Things Metric

Discussion in 'Zealot Archives' started by shrike, Apr 2, 2007.

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  1. Zathros

    Zathros Guest

    Having been a machinists for 20 odd years or so I can tell you from that perspective there are far more drill, and tap sizes in "American" than in metric. Letter drills, number drills , fractional drills. There is a lot more choices when making something out of "American" hardware than making an object using metric sizes. Dimensionally, it doesn't make a difference as an object is the size it is no matter how you measure it.
  2. Mark_1984

    Mark_1984 Guest

    If the metric system is so great, how come they haven't decimalised music :twisted:

    Can you imagine, 10 notes to the octave, 10 beats to the bar, 10 string guitars... Heaven knows how big a piano keyboard would be :-D
  3. paulhbell

    paulhbell Guest

    Zathos, you say ther are far more drill sizes with imperial, I disagree with you on the drills front. Drills can be bought or ground any size i.e. in metric 1.1 1.2 1.3 1.4 etc, 2.4 2.5 etc, 3.65 5.55 10.45 etc, I could go on. With imperial drills are set to certain fractions ie, 1/8 1/16 1/32 1/64. A metric drill can be any size, my company had drill's accurate to 5 decimal places ie 10.45555

    In 50 years the imperial sysem will not be around, it will have been phased out. Everyone who is using imperial in industry is moving over to metric.

    Even your new fighter (JSF), which hopefully the UK is going to buy, is using the metric system for building the plane.

    And I have been a machinist for 25 years, working in the UK, US, Germany, France.
  4. milenio3

    milenio3 Active Member

    Me living in the frontier line between Mexico and the USA, I live too between metrics and Imperial (we call it English) systems. So I drive to the limit of 80 kph, but I fill my car's tank with about 30 gallons of gas. Then I measure my kids' high in about 1 meter, but I buy him shoes size 1 "american". I put a 2 mts door, but drill it with 1/16" drill.

    And you can say everything about metric system, but NASA, JPL, and more I cannot remember right now (the military maybe?), in the USA, use metric system.
  5. SteveM

    SteveM Member

    Bull hockey. Never heard of decimal inches? All this "the great thing about metric is all the units are factors of ten" is bogus. The advantage of metric is that there is only ONE unit. There is one unit of length: the meter, one unit of volume: the liter, etc. All the milli- kilo-, mega-, micro- etc prefixes just tell you the power of ten to multiply the unit by. The confusing thing about imperial is the plethora of units for the same measure. That is, inches, feet, miles, etc are all different units of length.

    The thing is, there is nothing magic or more accurate about metric over imperial. You could just as easily pick one imperial unit, say the inch and apply it the same as you do the meter. You can just as easily speak about micro-inches (my industry, disk drives, uses microinches all the time), milli-inches ("mils"), mega-inches (yeah, not very common, but possible). There is nothing about imperial units that FORCE you to use fractional units of powers of 1/2, but it just typically makes it easier to convert between different units. 1/16 of a pound is one ounce, but there is really nothing stopping you from using tenths or hundredths of a pound. Nothing illegal about saying something weighs 29.54oz. or 1.57lbs.
  6. Maurice

    Maurice Member

    Oh yes there is, and it's explained in post # 25.
  7. Stev0

    Stev0 Active Member

    Did'nt the Americans have the metric system for like a weekend and go ... BAH! We ain't touching this with a 10' pole.


    Anyway. It's interesting that the US uses Imperial for everything except the Military who uses metric and is Governmental.
  8. Zathros

    Zathros Guest

    Uhh, I own an 1973 MG Midget, a 1973 Mercedes-Benz 450SL, a 1998 Honda Civic, a 1998 Subaru Legacy Wagon, a 1986 LaSalle Motorhome Chevy P Chassis. I am not anti-metric, "A metric drill can be any-size", You made my point, thanks. "Hope the Brits by the JSF", me too. I happen to really like the Canberra bomber, would love to see a paper model of it. I spent 2 months in England, I loved it, best fish 'n chips in the world and I could go for a bowl of Trifles right about now. My milling machine switches to metric by pressing a button. I have a calculator. "Dimensionally, it doesn't make a difference as an object is the size it is no matter how you measure it." I was referring to thread sizes on available sizing. Americans who actually work on cars, planes, boats, etc. work with metric and American standard sizes everyday. If you can't your not good at what you do not matter where you may be on in the little ball we live on. America bash England, never, I wouldn't, couldn't stand for it. I make my own recumbent trikes, full suspension, disc brakes. Some components are metric because I got them free, same for the American standard components, necessity is the mother of invention. I think you should be able to deal with whatever is thrown at you, no matter what it is. The metric vs anything debate is in stupid in my opinion. Use whatever you are comfortable with, I have tools for everything that I own and work on.
  9. lizzienewell

    lizzienewell Member

    In the US the land is all surveyed in 1 mile square blocks and the roads are on the section lines. Take a look at Oklahoma on Google Earth and you will see what I mean.
    Even if we removed all roads the marks on the land will remain. We will always have the mile.

    I'm comfortable with both kilometers and miles but in estimating distance I often go by major roadways that are placed on section lines.

  10. rowiac

    rowiac Member

    Even if the US finally does go completely metric some time in the far future, we will still have "foot long hot dogs", "inchworms" and Denver will still be the "Mile High City". Those terms won't change.

    I remember taking Thermodynamics back in college. The first semester was in SI units (Pascals, Watts, etc.). The second semester was in "American" units (BTU, psi, horsepower, etc.). Some of the students asked if we could use the SI units instead because the conversions were hard. The professor said, "Come on, this is what we use in the industry."

    I've learned to work with either system, but prefer metric for designing because of the easy conversions.

  11. charliec

    charliec Active Member

    I've always thought the metrication of measurement never went far enough. Time and angular measures are still based on some weird Babylonian system that goes back 2500 or more years.

    I seem to remember that time measurement was metricated during the French revolution but it never caught on.


  12. Mark_1984

    Mark_1984 Guest

    Ha ha - I never knew that. Here's the Wikipedia entry about it.

    Now, how about trying to Metrify the Calendar :twisted:
    10 months to the year - seems reasonable, although we should really get Nasa to re-position the moon so it orbits 10 times a year. Of course, then the Lunar New Year would coincide with the calendar New Year, depriving me of the chance to celebrate the New Year twice each year :cry:
    10 day to a month aint gonna work quite so well. That would mean 3.65 sunrises every day :roll: How the hell would you work out your overtime then ????

    That's probably enough silliness for one post :twisted:
  13. silverw

    silverw Member

    I guess it all boils down to what your human mind thinks is logical or easier! :wink:

    fi yuo cna raed this, yuo have a sgtrane mnid, too.
    Cna yuo raed this? Olny 55 plepoe tuo fo 100 anc.

    i cdnuolt blveiee taht I cluod aulaclty uesdnatnrd waht I was
    rdanieg. The
    phaonmneal pweor of the hmuan mnid, aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at
    Uinervtisy, it dseno't mtaetr in waht oerdr the ltteres in a wrod
    are, the olny
    iproamtnt tihng is taht the frsit and last ltteer be in the rghit
    pclae. The
    rset can be a taotl mses and you can still raed it whotuit a
    pboerlm. This is
    bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the
    wrod as
    a wlohe. Azanmig huh? yaeh and I awlyas tghuhot slpeling was
  14. Maurice

    Maurice Member

    Naet one Blil, yruoe gtinteg as bad as Yniav. :grin:

    But no it also depends on what the mind is fed.

    Looking at Paul's thread on the Wackett and seeing him hope that it would fly caused me to run the folowing ready to hand numbers and unaided calculations through the murky grey cells.
    Copy paper is usually c 0.1 mm thick and weighs c 80 gsm.
    so 10,000 sheets 1m sq. will stack to 1m giving a cubic metre weighing 800Kg. (and yes, paper and card products are that dense)
    Take my word for it or look it up but Balsa wood comes out at between 64 -380 Kg/m3 and obviously the lighter the better for flying models.
    So unfortunately Paul's Wackett may be a little overweight. (Sorry Paul)

    The challenge is to easily give a semi-formal mathematically sound prediction of the same conclusion using Imperial.
    I wouldn't even try.

    And here's another example.
    A certain waterbomber says it can lift 12 tonnes of water at one scoop. It is immediately obvious that it must have a water tank of c 12m3. As a visualisation that's approx a medium sized bedroom 1m deep in water. Imperial provides no such ready path to enlightenment.

    How much of the American problem is caused by "not invented here" syndrome ?
  15. Mark_1984

    Mark_1984 Guest

    I hate to say it but neither system was invented in America. The French lay claim to the metric system and the British to the Imperial system (Although I'm happy to be corrected.) No offence intended of course.
  16. Maurice

    Maurice Member

    None taken of course, but they who initially continued with the system for the newly independent America were essentially British and merely continued with what was theirs. They then melting-potted it on latecomers. :grin:
  17. -Jim G

    -Jim G Member

    Comfortable with the metric system? That is impossible! I tried to switch to the metric system... but it didn't work when I tried:

    Room temperature is 25 degrees, so I switched my thermostat to 25 degrees and I just about froze!

    The speed limit in town is 50. I told the police that I was simply driving metric.

    Seriously though, I am very comfortable in both the english and the metric systems. My engineering schooling during the late 70s and early 80's used the SI system exclusively, but in my job I deal only with english units.

    -Jim G
  18. MOS95B

    MOS95B Member

    Metric's got my vote...

  19. nx13688

    nx13688 Member

    No, the failure of the US to go metric happened because the always helpful US government decided to "assist" by letting both systems be used. So, of course, everyone ignored the system they weren't familiar with. Then it was more or less forgotten, since no one was using metric. Go figure. :cry:
  20. paulhbell

    paulhbell Guest

    metric/Imperial map

    Have a look at this map guys and gal. Grey is metric and blue is imperial.

    China is the fastest growing nation financially and they use metric.

    We have machine apprentice's who have told me they have not even looked at the imperial system, and they pass out in september 2007.

    I would say that in 10 years imperial won't be tought in school, so when those kids leave school they won't be able to read imperial drawings.
    Once the older people who use the imperial system start to retire (finish work), and the new kids start work, the imperial system will die. I give it 20/25 years at most.

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