Finally, Scubadude's Layout Plans, or ....

Discussion in 'Track Planning' started by scubadude, Jun 4, 2008.

  1. scubadude

    scubadude Member

    ....should I say "hope" instead of plan???? :confused:
    After almost 2 years of experimenting, I think I am getting close to an actual layout plan. I have started and quit at least 2 plans...I keep reading and seeing excellent projects on THE Gauge and keep changing my mind, so it's all y'alls fault, but here goes....:thumb:

    I am planning a u-shaped shelf layout that will be 18'' wide, 8' on each side and 11' across the back of the U, built along the walls of a 11' x 11' room.

    Right now, I want to concentrate on the middle section which will be a diesel maintenance facility and yard located between two or more towns with various industries on either side. The yard facility will be about 8' long. Operations will primarily be freight with interchange between other roads TBA later. The service facility will be light with fuel, sand, water and small engine house for repairs and RIP track. One or two engines with a switcher will be using the facility. There will be a small passenger depot along the passing siding at the top. I just don't have the expertise to design my own, so I found this small yard plan which seemed to be the ticket. For as you all know, I steal fair and square! sign1

    Could the experts here take a look and advise if I am on the right track???
    Questions I have would be:
    1) would this fit (with scenery and buildings) on 18"?,
    2) Where would you locate the RIP track?,
    3) How long should the yard lead be?,
    4) If the storage tracks are about 3' long, how many cars should make up a train leaving the yard?
    5) John Armstrong says this plan will foul the main line while assembling local freight, I can't see how, if so how can I avoid that?

    Sorry for the quality of the pic, I don't have a scanner and I just took a picture of the article. I am referring to the small yard at the top. The roundhouse will be replaced with a diesel facility building. If someone can convert this with a track planning program, I would love you forever! (Well, you know what I mean).sign1

    I will have a gillion more questions, this should get me going. Thanks for your help, I will do what you all tell me!!! (Be careful here!tooth1)

    ps- It will be N scale......

    Attached Files:

  2. 60103

    60103 Pooh Bah

    1) would this fit (with scenery and buildings) on 18"?,
    If you space the tracks at 2" (for HO) it will fit, even better if you replace the turntable.

    2) Where would you locate the RIP track?,
    Probably near the engine house, but do you need one? Do you have that many cars that don't work? :mrgreen:

    3) How long should the yard lead be?,
    Not sure :confused:

    4) If the storage tracks are about 3' long, how many cars should make up a train leaving the yard?
    40' boxcar standard: each track would have about 6 cars. You could use one track's worth or two, or even the whole yard.

    5) John Armstrong says this plan will foul the main line while assembling local freight, I can't see how, if so how can I avoid that?
  3. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic

    Yep, with room to spare;

    I'd put it north of the storage tracks (I didn't yet);

    I like to make it as long as possible, but sometimes (like here) space is limiting. Ideally, it should be (IMHO) at least as long as the longest track in the yard.

    As long as I've made them here, you'll get 12-13 40' cars, or 10 50' cars in each. The length of the train leaving the yard really depends on where it's going to go. Technically you could pull all the cars out of the storage tracks and the through tracks, and pull it out - however if your layout only goes another 8-10', you'll still be in the yard by the time your loco hits end-of-track.

    I'm not sure I see it either, unless the local freight is longer than the longest track, in which case you'd have to double out of the yard.

    Some specifics:

    #7 turnouts throughout
    1 1/8" track centres minimum
    12" minimum radius curves
    no easements.

    Attached Files:

  4. scubadude

    scubadude Member

    Thanks very much for your input. Squidbait, I really appreciate you taking the time to convert this to a legit trackplan. I guess I have to love you forever!! You know, in a manly sort of way!!!!sign1 I assume with the limited response to this thread, it must be a good design. I am still learning about operations, I hope this will allow me to do yard switching, staging locos and other cars for maintenance, and store other cars for delivery to interchange roads and industries elswhere on the layout.

    Another question, would it be prototypical to have a passenger station located at the passing siding? I plan to kitbash a small depot as a building front only due to space restrictions.

    Pipe in guys, I'm especially anxious to hear from Brakie :wave:
  5. logicman

    logicman Greybeard

    I wouldn't take any bets on that.

    Seriously: I think it's a good, uncluttered layout with a hint of the shunting puzzle.

  6. MasonJar

    MasonJar It's not rocket surgery

    You really can't go wrong when you follow the prototypical layout of a yard.

    I agree with all the answers here, and only have a few things to add...

    Your shortest double-ended track looks like about 2 feet or 4 cars on Squid's plan.

    You could extend the left side of that plan, if the left end of the yard is either bent around the corner, or the yard ladder (all the turnouts) are moved to line up with the curve. This may require making the left end of the ladder "point" the other way - i.e. build the ladder using right-hand turnouts, starting back on the curve. Squid's currently showin gthem as LH turnouts.

  7. Russ Bellinis

    Russ Bellinis Active Member

    It looks like a pretty good plan to me. I like Andrew's suggestion to increase the length of the yard tracks. I wouldn't be concerned one way or the other by the response, yet. This thread has only been up 2 days. You may get a lot more responses and suggestions as more people have the time to look it over.
  8. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic

    I think the runaround track is a bit superfluous in a yard this size, but by changing from #7 to #5 turnouts, we get longer through tracks. The shortest goes to 8 40' cars from 6 on the other version.

    Yes, it would be prototypical to have the station on the outside of the siding... if you pull the yard closer to the edge of the layout, you could even have an express/lcl/team track behind the station. I stuck an extra stub track in that you could use as a RIP track.

    Attached Files:

  9. Kevinkrey

    Kevinkrey Member

    " Ideally, it should be (IMHO) at least as long as the longest track in the yard."​


  10. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic

    I just realized a bitmap isn't that helpful to you! :eek:

    Here's the XtrkCad file for the yard plan with #5 turnouts.

    Attached Files:

  11. brakie

    brakie Active Member

    Actually there is no switching puzzle there..What you are looking at is a prototypically design yard.

    The yard can use a "runner" track though.
  12. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic

    Something like this?

    Attached Files:

  13. brakie

    brakie Active Member

    Squid,A runner track goes from one end of the yard to the other..Its use to get locomotives from the indound tracks to the inbound engine service track or get the engines from the outbound ready track to their trains.This also allows the switch crew to go from one end of the yard to the other.
  14. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic


    It's not a term I'm familiar with. The only clear example I could find of one was on a shelf layout that allowed the power to come out of the shops and move into the yard without having to move any spotted cars.

    There are a couple of sites on the web that talk about the "runner track", but don't show where it is or what it does.

    Functionally, I see the point. But with this plan, I can't see squeezing one in without having a very short stub or runaround track underneath it.
  15. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic

    OK, this is a quickie attempt to incorporate a runner track. Basically it meant shortening the storage tracks, but now there's a complete runaround for the through tracks that leads directly to the engine servicing area.

    I think it's the best compromise without a serious re-engineering of the east end of the yard.

    Attached Files:

  16. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic

    I think the problem with a runner track, at least in a small yard, is that it takes up a lot of real-estate that could be used for another through track or a storage track.

    Here's a yard based on the Canadian National yard in Brantford Ontario. It's obviously quite compressed, but the general schematic is the same. The turntable and roundhouse have been gone since the '50s, but I've guessed they probably came off the runner track, as I've done it.

    Attached Files:

  17. scubadude

    scubadude Member

    Great stuff, guys :thumb:. I have been away on a dive trip, doing a little underwater video for a news agency about a wreck off the coast of South Padre Island. Rough seas, glad to be back on land....

    I am excited to see this yard facility grow into a working model...special thanks to Squidbait (I love you, man :mrgreen:). Between you and Brakie, I hope to come out smellin' like a rose here.

    I did manage to start on the new benchwork, I will post pics soon. Should have the work completed sometime this week, and on to the laying of track!!!

    My newest list of questions come out of ignorance of some terminology:
    1. What is the purpose/function of the "yard lead", and why does it have
    to be as long as possible?
    2. Define: runaround tracks...
    runner tracks...
    through tracks....
    3. With respect to the service tracks, should the sand, fuel and water
    stations be along the track leading to the engine building (Pikestuff)?

    More questions later......
  18. Squidbait

    Squidbait Recovering ALCO-holic

    Enough with the public mushiness! I'm blushing already! :oops:

    Besides, if you've been at sea for a week, it'll probably take awhile for you to smell of anything other than kelp and neoprene! :p

    The yard lead allows the yard crew to switch the yard without having to come out on the main. Basically, the longer the lead, the more efficient the switching can become, since you don't have to constantly back and fill to get the cars where they need to be.

    More-or-less the same thing from a trackplan point of view - they're all double-ended tracks, so you can get into them from either end, unlike a storage track which is single-ended. The runaround/through tracks let you do what they say, either runaround something, or go right through. The runner track Brakie explained above - it lets a loco go to/from the loco servicing area to/from its train without fouling the yard or the main.

    I would think so.
  19. brakie

    brakie Active Member

    That will work as a runner track..These tracks are every important for yard operation because the road power can run to or from the engine terminal without interfering with the yard switch crew.Also the caboose crew can add or remove cabooses from the train by using the runner.

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