metaseq lunatics Hi Jim This is a laugh but you and I clowning about may help others and at least give people a laugh. To get the grid ( I hate all grids they make my eyes funny) on the top row select 'view grid - set grid - play with numbers to suit' I think your picture has too many pixels I cut mine down to 1280 x 800 as long as you can see it clearly it's ok Ignore the scaling for it's all relative somewhere. I had a swift glance at an .mqo file last night which basically seems to be a text file of coordinates so it should be space efficient. the various elements are turned on and off in the object panel on the pic there are 1 to 3 is the forecastle 4-9 midships and 10 -12 the stern 4 to 9 are turned on with the eye in the first column and if the key in the next column shows they are locked (they need to be with me). The object currrently in use is number 4 just click to make it active and click on another to change it. In the edit panel you have to imagine that each button is a slider going left right only takes some getting used to. I let the formers (hull cross sections) build up on the red,green,blue junction and haul them into place with edit panel blue button and watch the progress in the "Left" panel. The panels are called down from the top windows button "Panel" I really have no idea if this way will work yet but we can but hope and as Maurice says "points are drawn at owners risk". regards barry ps Save it often as always "c**kups unlimited"