eBay Does It Again

Discussion in 'Getting Started' started by riverotter, May 8, 2008.

  1. riverotter

    riverotter Midwest Alliance Rail Sys

    eBay announced on Wednesday 5/7/08 that they will no longer
    allow feedback withdrawal.

    Details and rationale are posted on eBay's announcements board:
    May 2008

    This is the latest of the many "bold changes" eBay has instituted
    recently that, IMHO, have had an adverse effect on both the buying
    and selling experience on eBay.

    Here's the text of eBay's posting:

    Hello everyone...as we announced back in January, we're making
    some bold changes to how Feedback on eBay works. As we get
    closer to our launch, I wanted to review the changes we've
    discussed and provide some additional detail and updates.

    As a recap, here's what we announced in January that is scheduled
    to launch the week of May 19th in North America (which includes
    eBay.com in the US, as well as eBay.ca and eBay.cafr in Canada):

    > Sellers may only leave positive feedback for buyers

    > We will remove negative and neutral Feedback if a member
    becomes suspended

    > Members can leave Feedback up to 60 days after a transaction
    (down from 90)

    > We will remove Feedback when a buyer fails to respond to the
    unpaid item process.

    > Members will receive credit for weekly repeat Feedback (going
    back to 1996)

    > We will base the Positive Feedback Percentage on the past 12
    months of activity (and include neutral Feedback in the calculation)

    > The PowerSeller Program will use the same calculation method
    described above to determine eligibility for the PS Program for the
    Positive Feedback percentage requirement of 98% positive.

    In January we mentioned that we'd block buyers from leaving
    negative or neutral Feedback for 3 days for sellers "with a track
    record." Since January, we've made the decision to increase the
    wait period to 7 days and define "track record" as active
    PowerSellers who have been on eBay for at least 12 months.

    We studied the factors that increased risk to buyers the most and
    found there are three: a) a seller's Positive Feedback percentage
    and DSRs, b) the volume of a seller's Feedback – both in total and
    on an ongoing basis and c) length of time a seller has been on site.

    We selected PowerSellers who have been on eBay at least 12
    months in order to minimize risk to buyers, because:

    a. PowerSellers have to meet quality thresholds for both
    conventional Feedback and, starting in July, for Detailed Seller

    b. PowerSellers have to meet volume requirements – both in total
    and on an ongoing basis

    c. One year on-site proved to be an important predictor of lower

    All three factors prove important to predicting the risk to buyers –
    removing any one of them would increase risk to a level we are not
    currently comfortable with at this time.

    We will watch all aspects of the new Feedback system very
    carefully, studying how the marketplace responds and we will make
    changes as we see appropriate.

    We mentioned that we'd be aligning the Mutual Feedback
    Withdrawal process with the new system. After much
    consideration, we've made the decision to remove the Mutual
    Feedback Withdrawal process. The reason is that – under the new
    rules - it opens sellers up to extortion. As part of this decision,
    Mutual Agreement from third-party Feedback mediation services,
    such as SquareTrade, will also no longer be accepted.

    Over the last several months, we've had many conversations with
    our customers – both buyers and sellers – and we've had the
    opportunity to consider ways we can address some of the top
    concerns we've heard. Based on the input we've received from you,
    I want to share some additional modifications we're making:

    We are adding language in the leave Feedback flow for buyers who
    are in a cross-border transaction that reminds them that
    international transactions usually take longer to complete.

    We've improved the interstitial page that all buyers see before
    leaving negative or neutral Feedback; the updated page offers a
    stronger message to buyers about the need to communicate with
    the seller, to allow enough time for the transaction to complete,
    and to keep Feedback factual.

    And later this month...

    In addition to expanding the 3-day block to 7 days, we are
    introducing a new Buyer Requirement that will allow sellers to block
    buyers who have been reported by other sellers for eBay buying
    policy violations (such as Feedback abuse, or email threats).

    We're expanding the scope of the existing Buyer Requirement for
    unpaid items, so that it supports more comprehensive blocking of
    buyers who have a history of non-payment.

    We've improved the process that sellers use to report buyers for
    policy violations.

    Detailed Seller Ratings will be coming to Half in the next couple
    months. Watch for more information on this via email and on the
    Half discussion forum in the next couple of weeks.

    These changes represent a huge investment in
    transforming the way Feedback works, so that it better serves
    today's marketplace. Ultimately, the goal is to restore trust and
    transparency and improve the buying experience, while offering
    needed checks and balances that ensure our sellers who provide
    excellent service benefit.
  2. beamish

    beamish HO & Steam Engineer

    Funny I never did see this message and I have been using ebay a lot in the last few days. I guess they forgot me. :(

    Anyway.... there are some good things i see in that list and not too much that will effect the way i do things.

    I am interested to see what some others view points are on this subject.
  3. iis612

    iis612 Member

    As a frequent seller on eBay, I am personally disgusted with some of the changes.
    Buyers never really needed to be concerned about completing a transaction except for the negative feedback alerting other sellers. Now, and I am seeing this trend already, the number of non-paying bidders is going to swell. And why not, there is really nothing a seller can do about it anymore.
    I say if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
  4. CNWman

    CNWman CNW Fan

    Soooooo... even if you try to leave a bad comment for a bad buyer, they still get positive reviews?:confused:

    Riiiiiiiiiiight. Gee, why does the underlined not sound convincing?

    Excuse me? Where's positive feedback option?
  5. RonP

    RonP Member of the WMRC

    Pfff you know what ? Sellers wait to see how a buyer decides his feedback is before doing theirs this is in no way fair as then the seller can harass or even hold the buyers rep in their hands.

    You see too many sellers try to save money by putting the price on the buyer that is wrong. Life is a two way street and some of these greedy losers should get a bad rep for hidden costs.

    Hidden Costs ? yeah money orders and shipping charges get expensive especially if the item was under $20.

    Go ahead start a war about my words I am confident that the customers is and always will be right. Hence no negative feedback.
  6. RonP

    RonP Member of the WMRC

    Like me you are a customer and I do not see anything wrong either.
  7. N Gauger

    N Gauger 1:20.3 Train Addict

    I sell a lot of things in e-bay .. I always try to please my customers.. I also have the buyer pay shipping and a bit towards the e-bay and paypal charges.. :)

    If I didn't..... this is what it would look like (this is an ACTUAL auction I just sold last Saturday):

    Buyer Pays shipping
    Sold-----Inc. Ship-----e-bay fee---paypal---Profit

    Seller (me) pays shipping
    Sold----Ship & Ins-----e-bay fee---paypal---Profit
    $6.99-----$7.03--------$0.61------$0.71---- Minus $1.36 I actually Lose 1.36

    E-bay charges for listing, for final value and their "sister" company Paypal charges for monies received....

    So you see... without charging a fair shipping + hidden fee.. Note I said "Fair" fee... there is no possible way to make money unless you charge the buyer for shipping, Insurance, packaging, and those "Hidden fees" :( :(
  8. N Gauger

    N Gauger 1:20.3 Train Addict

    When you leave feedback there are 3 "buttons" to choose from


    Once you choose them a text box appears, so you can leave actual comments...

    From now on when a seller clicks on "Leave Feedback" there will only be 1 choice


    ... and the comment box..... You can still leave negative comments, but the "Feedback Score" will only reflect Positive comments..

    BTW - this isn't quite fair, because those same buyers getting all this positive feedback will be sellers too - it makes them "potentially" look better as sellers because of their "Above normal" positive feedback...

    That's not a good gauge of character anymore... unless you do a lot of research into how much they have bought vs sold. :( Just one more thing to worry about...
  9. RonP

    RonP Member of the WMRC

    Mike I am sorry but I will not change my mind. The fact you do use paypal is a big plus in my books for you though. It is the guys that say no paypal i pay to much blah blah blah.

    This subject blows a fuse for me. Nothing comes free and Ebay do deserve to make money too.

    just take an ad out in the newspaper if you are worried about all this. No shipping and you actually exchange money by hand costs nothing in most cases.

    I'd like to see what all you would say if we were talking about gas right now.

    I am the customer, if i become the seller I will not forget that.
  10. riverotter

    riverotter Midwest Alliance Rail Sys

    This statement near the end was interesting to me: "Ultimately, the goal is to restore trust and transparency and improve the buying experience, while offering needed checks and balances that ensure our sellers who provide excellent service benefit."

    Did I miss something? Was there a "crisis of trust" between eBay and its customers - buyers and/or sellers - that required action(s) to restore that trust?
  11. N Gauger

    N Gauger 1:20.3 Train Addict

    Yes, basically greed reared it's ugly head.. or is that "Free Commerce and capitalism"???? :( :(

    There were buyers threatening to leave sellers negative feedback if they didn't get what they wanted... and some of the things they wanted was way above and beyond "fair trade"... :(

    ............Classic case of the few - ruining it for the many wall1

    Of course this went the other way too.. As Ron said - Sellers trying to get away with cheating some people. :(

    I have been ripped off 3 times since '97 and i still keep going.. I have way more Good experiences than bad.. :) :D :) :D
  12. Mountain Man

    Mountain Man Active Member

    In the military, this was known as CYA. In the civilian world, it's commonly known as "spin".

    However, none of this is anything new. Try posting feedback to any major internet organization, including your ISP, and see what happens. Perhaps MSN is the most blatant in this matter; to "contact MSN", which is my ISP, I have to go through AOL, clearly a move designed to stop feedback altogether.

    My philosophy has always been to vote with my wallet. The purchasing public controls immense power in this regard, although far too few use it; most continue to use a flawed service regardless.

    If you really want e-Bay's attention, stop spending any money there. There are many other options for buyers and sellers of MRR products to get together and conduct business, and e-Bay will get the message very quickly.
  13. RonP

    RonP Member of the WMRC

    Yeah I have no problem with sellers in general it is the few that find a way to email you and make weird and 10 paragraph statements expecting you to read the whole pile of crap sent.

    Obviously it is a two way street to which I didn't immediatly recognize buyers getting crafty. But that is what the report abuse is for.

    I think that E-bay may be better off doing the rock paper scissors thing where Ebay sends mail saying it is time for feedback not showing either the buyer or seller the feedback till they vote. If you don't take the opportunity to post feedback it is gone in 7 days after which feedback is stuck.
  14. Russ Bellinis

    Russ Bellinis Active Member

    I have never used ebay, this looks like not using ebay continues to be an excellent decision
  15. Paladin

    Paladin Member

    I have steadily decreased my use of eBay, both selling, and buying. In particular, the shipping cost are rediculous on some items. I mean, sending a large package, weighing about 5lbs across the country costs me less than $10.00, yet some sellers have shipping set at $20, $30, or even $40. If they are setting these "fees", why don't they say so. I have sold several things on eBay, and I never charge the buyer for shipping, becuase I can figure that cost myself, and try to set a starting price that will at least cover that. I have only lost money once from a sale, and it wasn't more than $10.
    As far as their new policy, and talking with customers, and sellers, no one has ever asked my opinion on any thing there.
    Oh well, I guess that is life, and ebay is just another multi-million dollar business
  16. eightyeightfan1

    eightyeightfan1 Now I'm AMP'd

    I don't use e-bay either, but it looks to me that a lot of sellers, the one's with ebay stores, complained a lot about being given so many negative feedbacks(I'm sure some buyers are mixed in there too).
    What e-bay should be doing instead of implementing new policy is ask these sellers "Well...Why are you getting so many negative feedbacks?"
  17. scubadude

    scubadude Member

    I think the operative word here is "hidden"....if the seller is up front about ALL charges, then the burden is on the buyer if they bid. What irrated me (I quit Ebay years ago) was getting emails from sellers with up to 50% more charges for "handling". Paypal is just a cost of doing business in my opinion and should be on the seller, not the buyer. I think that sellers who are not up front with those "hidden" charges are trying to get into your wallet...shame on them...
    Just what I think....
  18. N Gauger

    N Gauger 1:20.3 Train Addict

  19. RonP

    RonP Member of the WMRC

    At least I'm not on my own, that don't happen very often.

    At least it all stayed civil
  20. ScratchyAngel

    ScratchyAngel Member

    Can Sellers actually use negative feedback anyway?

    I mean buyers can decide not to buy from one or two really harsh recent negative feedbacks, but can a seller reject a bid because he sees a comment that the guy is a deadbeat?


Share This Page